Islam - A Short History - Karen Armstrong ( Religion - Spirituality - Muhammad - Quran )

Amazon.com The picture of Islam as a violent, backward, and insular tradition should be laid to rest, says Karen Armstrong, bestselling author of Muhammad and A History of God. Delving deep into Islamic history, Armstrong sketches the arc of a story that begins with the stirring of revelation in an Arab businessman named Muhammad. His concern with the poor who were being left behind in the blush of his society's new prosperity sets the tone for the tale of a culture that values community as a manifestation of God. Muhammad's ideas catch fire, quickly blossoming into a political empire. As the empire expands and the once fractured Arabs subdue and overtake the vast Persian domain, the story of a community becomes a panoramic drama. With great dexterity, Armstrong narrates the Sunni-Shi'ite schism, the rise of Persian influence, the clashes with Western crusaders and Mongolian conquerors, and the spiritual explorations that traced the route to God. Armstrong brings us through the debacle of European colonialism right up to the present day, putting Islamic fundamentalism into context as part of a worldwide phenomenon. Islam: A Short History, like Bruce Lawrence's Shattering the Myth and Mark Huband's Warriors of the Prophet, introduces us to a faith that beckons like a minaret to those who dare to venture beyond the headlines. --Brian Bruya From Publishers Weekly Readers seeking a quick but thoughtful introduction to Islam will want to peruse Armstrong's latest offering. In her hallmark stylish and accessible prose, the author of A History of God takes readers from the sixth-century days of the Prophet Muhammad to the present. Armstrong writes about the revelations Muhammad received, and explains that the Qur'an earned its name (which means recitation) because most of Muhammad's followers were illiterate and learned his teachings not from reading them but hearing them proclaimed aloud. Throughout the book, Armstrong traces what she sees as Islam's emphasis on right living (? la Judaism) over right belief (? la Christianity). Armstrong is at her most passionate when discussing Islam in the modern world. She explains antagonisms between Iraqi Muslims and Syrian Muslims, and discusses the devastating consequences of modernization on the Islamic world. Unlike Europe, which modernized gradually over centuries, the Islamic world had modernity thrust upon it in an exploitative manner. The Islamic countries, Armstrong argues, have been "reduced to a dependent bloc by the European powers." Armstrong also rehearses some basics about Islamic fundamentalism in a section that will be familiar to anyone who has read her recent study, The Battle for God. A useful time line and a guide to the "Key Figures in the History of Islam" complete this strong, brisk survey of 1,500 years of Islamic history. (Aug.)

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Halbermunken (2007-01-17)

There is no religion of peace, you can find whatever you want in your "holy books" to justify your actions.
Religion is a perfect tool for controlling humans...and in many cases for the worse.
"The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin

shazan (2007-02-06)

Know before you hate

http://www.sunnipath.com/
http://www.muslimheritage.com/
http://www.muslimphilosophy.com/
http://www.islamicity.com/science/
http://www.cyberistan.org/
http://www.islamicarchitecture.org/

http://www.zaytuna.org/
http://seekeraftertruth.com/?p=115

sinan30us (2007-03-11)

to: shazan
What an idiot.. If you are going to spread som islamic propaganda at least don't use such sites. You could as well refer to bin Ladin himself as a harmless good muslim.
Think before you write..
http://www.sunnipath.com/
PS! I'm no islamophobic, I'm a muslim myself.

darkman_123 (2007-06-18)

shazan
thanx allot for this links, it was needed. Jazaka Allah khaier.
PS! don't care about brother sinan30us's comments :)

Manas1 (2007-09-04)

jdylan, so why do you live in that so bad muslim country? There are a lot of muslim countries. You judge 1,5 billion people by only going to one muslim country. Qatar or other "muslim" countries do not represent islam. The words of God does, Koran.
www.al-ghazali.org

Icelociss (2007-10-28)

Hi Shazan, first of all thanks a lot for putting this audio book on tpb.I think karen armstrong is a person who deeply researches her work before putting it into print.I have two of her books ,The History of God and this one.And I was delightfully surprised to see this book in audio format.
Secondly for all the people who have commented on the religion versus the quality of the audio book or the file format,please remember ur on tpb.com which is one hell of a website for sharing.Sharing is also what all religions teaches us.So if ur on tpb, dont spread hate but love & peace.
I am sure when anakata started this site his idea was simple, share and be happy.
Lastly all religions teach us the same thing ,that there is a God and he is Great and in following him we shall be happy.
So spread the message on tpb and lets all live happily!!
Cheers,
Ice.

vision2006 (2007-11-27)

Believing is easier than thinking, thats why the muslims are true believers. Do not ever trust them !!!!

Schopenhauer (2008-02-19)

idylan, the buddhist, wrote about the muslims;
"Fuckwad hypocrits"
Is this buddhism? No. Compassionate? By his definitation of musklim he seems to be one himself.
All religion can be missused, but they all are ways to try to trancend egoism, hate and lack of love/compassion if read right. No worldreligion says "try to be as bad person as possible and do all that is wrong and harmful and you will be blessed" Why is everyone so angy? Its more pleasent to be joyful. Say something nice once in a while to see how it feels, its worth a try. And might become a habit.

3G0M4N14K (2008-03-26)

thank you Schopenhauer, you took the words out of my mouth! is it REALLY very Buddhist-like to be THAT prejudiced and rude? how can you judge Islam by 1 country? there are soooooo many different cultures/countries that practice, so many different interpretations. there are places like turkey (that have had a women prime minister) and places like Afghanistan (where women have few to no rights), but one can not generalize the statement to all Muslims. please people read something that is not anti-islam before you make a judgment on it...i was very anti-islam (i thought it was an anti-semmetic, women-hating, and very violent religion) but after listening to "Great World Religions: Islam" by John L. Esposito my mind was changed ENTIRELY, so broaden your horizons.

kneebow (2008-04-15)

At least Christians aren?t being killed in Iraq anymore and thus more people can go to heaven over there. That means that they have many of the same freedoms that we have here. Thank God for that! God is not an evil God; there is no sin in him. He sent his Son to die for our sins not for the believer to kill himself off in an act of Jihad. The Bible is more prevalent in the world ? everybody in the modern world has heard of Jesus Christ, I assume. If you want proof of God?s existence, read the Bible and confess that Jesus Christ is Lord. Take a leap of faith and you will be blessed, for it says that in the last times that all who confess the name of the Lord will be saved. As a believer you are justified by faith, so all your sins are cancelled out; then you become sanctified, then you become glorified in Heaven. I know from personal experience that God is true. I once wrote against him and was judicated for it; like the conversion of Paul, I was miraculously saved by Jesus to become what I am today. I know that Christianity is not a phony religion. It is the only true religion. There are many facts to support it. Over sixty authors, who wrote at different times, where inspired to write the Book; there is way too much continuity for a book of that size and scope; the parallels between Elijah and John The Baptist, for instance, the over 200 prophesies that came true by the coming of Christ, our Lord. How could all of this came true if the writers where just guessing or off their rockers? For we know that Jesus was a real figure, as historical documents prove by the trial he had under Pontius Pilate. Please believe Jesus, ?I am the way the truth and the life, no one comes to the father except through me.? Pray to Jesus now and accept Him. He will continue a good work in you until you meet him. Trust in God.

kneebow (2008-04-15)

God is a Christian.

kneebow (2008-04-15)

For the buddist. Even passive resitance is resitance. Look at all the turmoil surrounding the olipmpic(sp) games at the moment. Who will forgive you of your sins anyways; your creator is greater and more holy than you; he must punbsih sinners as we all are; how else can you be secure on judgemnt day than to trust in Jesus and be forgiven of all past sins. If you don't belive that you are a sinner take a good look at yourself. Please don't resist the Truth.

rockstar11998 (2008-04-23)

Halbermunken - It's funny how you use a quote of Benjamin Franklin that actually puts down your argument. God's ways are higher than our ways and Ben Franklin knew that. To men the wisdom of God is foolishness. You just pointed out what a fool you are. You can't use reasoning to prove God exists or doesn't. It takes faith to know Him and nothing you can say will change that.
shazan - thanks for the list of sites not to go to. I have a list for you. Watch these to get informed properly about Islam and how evil it is. "Obsession", "What the West Needs to Know", "BBC - Unholy War", "CNN - God's Muslim Warriors", "Undercover Mosque", and "Israel, Islam, and Armageddon".
jdylan - Thanks for your comments. Muslims are so messed up. They want to make the rest of the world as bad as it is where you live - Qatar. They are starting to take over Europe and it won't be long before they start to take over parts of the United States.
Manas1 - These so called Muslims get their basis for this type of living from the Koran so where is your argument now?
Icelociss - we aren't spreading hate and fear. Islam has already done that and we want to fight against it. And about letting religions just teach many ways to worship God you sound like you just want to disregard all of the past and let Jews continued to be slaughtered. There can't be many ways to get to heaven or God would not be just and fair.
vision2006 and red456 - LMFAO at those comments.
Schopenhauer - I have one quote for your comment to let Islam just do its thing. "The only thing that needs to happen for Evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing". If you are a good man then stand up for truth. Islam wants to take over the world and it's not gonna do it peacefully because that would take forever.

rockstar11998 (2008-04-23)

kneebow - Hi there. It is great to hear about your conversion story. The biggest problem with Islam is their Antichrist attitude. How will they have forgiveness of sins without a perfect atonement?? They will have to live with sin until the time of the Millennium I guess.

CarlWilfilUranus (2008-05-26)

rockstar11998 - It's funny how you use a quote of Edmund Burke that actually puts down your argument. Fact is that good men ARE doing something: We are worshipping the ?all-mighty? Dollar, coveting, stealing, butchering each other all in the name of our chosen leaders and of course God (How many gods are there? Just ONE!). And while we?re distracted dealing with ?threats to our National Security? OUTSIDE our borders, tyranny is tightening its grip on our balls right here at home! Trouble is, we ?can?t see the wood from the trees?. Ben Laden didn?t cause 9-11. It was the Powers that be! But being a nation of intellectual paraplegics, we reckoned Muslims could be as convincing scapegoats as any! So let?s all jump on the bandwagon and ostracize Muslims and Islam ?cos ?they?re different?, right? But depending on the incident (and contemporary media hype), we?d just as easily jump on Jews, Mormons, Protestants, Japanese Americans, Afro-Americans, etc., etc. Native Americans are old hat! They?ve been beaten into oblivion: they don?t matter anymore! You say Muslims are so messed up. They want to make the rest of the world as bad as it is where you live? Have you heard of the Inquisition? The killing is still going on. That?s 90 million people and counting: all in the name of Jesus! Rockstar11998, I wish you?d do some serious reading before pointing a misdirected finger. After all, is there any credibility to a virgin writing about the joy of sex? Like Edmund Burke also said, "It required an unbroken attention, to form a true judgment." (1783.)

rockstar11998 (2008-05-30)

CarlWilfilUranus - Hi there Antichrist. I never misused the quote nor does it put down my argument. If you are a good man then you are a very deceived one because Islam is an Evil religion. It is where it is today because of Evil philosophies. It didn't spread through peace but through war and violence. If you say this is a lie then you are truly blinded and need a good history lesson.
You just spouted off a bunch of nonsense and conspiracy crap that makes you look very foolish. So you want to lump Americans/Christians in with the Inquisition?? Umm ok that's a stretch. I don't claim any Christian church had authority from God to cause and wars or kill anyone from 100 A.D. to 1820 A.D. There was this thing called the apostasy and Christianity was full of false doctrine, false teachers and prophets until the year 1820. Joseph Smith put to rest all of that confusion and strife. Today there is only one true church upon the face of the whole earth. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. It holds the keys, powers, authority, and doctrine to teach and exercise the true Gospel of Jesus Christ. There is a true prophet alive today that speaks to the whole world about what God wants us to do. His name is Thomas S. Monson - prophet, seer, and revelator. I don't jump on any bandwagons because I am Mormon. We are already ostracized and that was foretold as well. I pick on Islam because it is the greatest threat to the whole world and because I am informed more so than you apparently.
I don't care whose name the early Christian churches killed others in the name of. They had no right or authority of God to do so. I do not support killing innocent people unless a prophet of God directs it (Old Testament). Remember God wiped out everyone in the days of Noah besides his family. It is supposed to be as wicked as in the days of Noah in these last days so he's gonna create another great slaughter when Christ comes again. Will you be on the side of good or evil? Will you bow down to the beast and his idol or will you join the ranks of the saints? If you continue will your current state of thinking you'll do the former.
You say I need to do a bunch of reading before I post. Well sir I've done plenty of that. Actually I prefer to watch videos and read internet topics instead of books. I have way more knowledge about the subject than you might suppose. I just prefer to promote the good stuff that is easy access to all. I may not sound like the most knowledgeable about Islam but I learn more and more every day how deceitful it is and how it's just a perversion of Christian and Judaic beliefs established by Satan through the false prophet Muhammad. I am not worried at all about your comments because I have over 20 years of religious training and study to back up my words and a firm testimony of Joseph Smith and the Book of Mormon. All of this cannot be argued nor debated. You have no way to set aside what is in my heart no matter what. I hold the Holy Melchezidek Priesthood and can easily discern good from evil and you sir are supporting evil ways.
You mentioned that the U.S. has brought upon itself the problems it has today. Well I very much agree with that . This was foretold my modern day prophets and The Book of Mormon and Doctrine and Covenants. Looks like you need to do some reading.

CarlWilfilUranus (2008-05-31)

rockstar11998, for a self-professed ?informed? intellectual, you sure dwell on unsubstantiated generalizations and name calling to attempt jostling your point across, don?t you? That?s a tendency one usually out grows in Junior High. Nevertheless, in the Christian spirit, I?ll turn the other cheek; after all, just ?cos some idiot refers to me as ?antichrist? doesn?t make me so. Reciprocally, just ?cos some recipient of Mormon venom thinks you?re an idiot, doesn?t really make you so (unless, of course, you ARE! In which case, we both belong in the same Coocoo?s Nest ?cos only an idiot would embark on an ?intelligent discussion? with another idiot! Get my drift? So let?s start afresh: You could pretend I?m not Antichrist, and I?ll pretend you?re not an idiot. Deal?) Now, for a guy who does ?not sound like the most knowledgeable about Islam?, you sure pass judgment on it real easy, don?t ya? Sorta like reading about the joys of sex written by a puritanical virgin, wouldn?t ya say? Since we?re having an honest parley, I gotta admit I know just a tad bit more than Zilch about the LDS. Only bits and pieces of stuff I picked up during my 2 year stay in Logan, Utah from some really super Mormon families there who?s religious and moral beliefs, I might add, were conspicuously absent of the bigoted, militant ingredient reflected thru? your ?over 20 years of religious training and study?. For someone who ?prefers to watch videos and read internet topics instead of books?, you must be one hell of an authority on world affairs to dismiss irrefutable evidence as ?conspiracy crap? and a ?bunch of nonsense?. Have you considered offering your considerable intellectual talents to the likes of US News & World Reports, or Wall Street Journal, or Forbes? No? THANK GOD! You observe quite correctly ?There was this thing called the apostasy and Christianity was full of false doctrine, false teachers and prophets until the year 1820?. What makes you so darn sure that the LDS Church isn?t part of the apostasy mentioned in the Holy Bible, or that Joseph Smith isn?t one of the false prophets to add to all ?that confusion and strife?? I heard tell that Mormonism was actually a perversion of Christianity! But according to you, that would put Muslims and Mormons in the same boat! One could always point an accusatory finger at ?that polygamous cult?! But wait a doggone minute here: Muslims also have an option to practice polygamy! So did Jews and other Christians not too far back! But whereas you guys sold your God-given right in exchange for Statehood and ?political correctness?, Muslims have not. I guess that makes us evil! Get your history right, my friend! Islam never spread thru? wars but by INVITATION and the example set by Muslims. Contrast this with the raping and pillaging expeditions of the Crusades, and the Inquisition WHICH HAS NEVER ENDED! More than 90 million ?heretics? dead and counting! (Oh! Lest we forget, those are the evil Christians. Doesn?t include Mormons!!) God commands in the Holy Quran: ?There is no compulsion in religion ? if the unbelievers prevent you from worshipping me, seek them out and strike them wherever they hide??. As for Terrorism (HIRABA), God forbids it. But terrorists (of all religions) are very talented at slanting the Word of God, aren?t they? Tell you what: I?ll pray to Allah for you. And you can pray to God for me! How does that sound? Anyway, rockstar, it?s been fun ? now I gotta run! Peace!

rockstar11998 (2008-06-01)

CarlWilfilUranus - I love how you try to put me down for my plainness and assume that what I speak of is unsubstantiated. Just because you've not been properly informed doesn't mean they aren't facts. I don't need your opinions about the matter because I already have the truth and no matter how many so called intellectuals and philosophers tell me otherwise I won't deny or say anything against the witness of the Spirit.
You speak in very metaphoric language, where you seem to be coming across as some type of know it all but the scriptures says those who are as proud as you will be humbled. You are also hard to follow because you have all sorts of incomplete sentences and question marks everywhere. Yes you are a type of Antichrist because you are trying to lead others away from the true gospel of Jesus Christ. So by definition you fit the name. Fools mock but they shall mourn. You try to belittle me with your I'll pretend this and you'll pretend that. So lame. I don't need to pretend anything because I already know where I stand and you are totally in the dark of where you stand. If you know anything about the allegory of the tree of life then it is clear to me you are one of those that are blinded by the mists of darkness. You are not clinging to the iron rod (the word of God). You'll never taste of the fruits of eternal life until you turn yourself in the right direction and fulfill the requirements of salvation.
It's clear we can't have a discussion because you assume you know way too much and tend to believe and made up conspiracy crap you can find. Whether I'm an expert on world affairs or not makes no difference on what my testimony of the truth is. I could care less what you thought of the Mormons you met in Logan Utah. Ever hear of the Parable of the 10 virgins? Well that is a discription of how about half of the members of the LDS church will not be ready or prepared for Christ's second coming. I've met plenty of Mormons by name but not good practicing myself. Every church can say the same about their membership. It does not make me fearful or sad to see this since everyone has a choice to live what they know is true or not. How many people take drivers training yet many of them choose to speed, cut others off, not signal, or run red lights which puts others in danger. I know that's off topic but it proves a point that we all make our own choices. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is the only true church upon the face of the whole earth no matter how of its members don't abide by its precepts. I've had way more good experiences with members of my church than bad so don't think you can sway me on its truthfulness. I know you read and regurgitated plenty of anti-Mormon lies by the way you speak about my church.
You want to know how I know my church is not just another wannabe religion right? You'll never understand because spiritual things are discerned only through the spirit. With your high mindedness and hardheartedness you'll never reach the ability to understand spiritual things. I have a spiritual witness that since I'd be casting my pearls before swine so I'd rather not share it with you. That's right I went there.
I don't need to go into the practice of poligamy with you do I? Didn't you know that it was practiced in the Old Testament? So it's not a new doctrine now is it. I don't have to explain anything more because its a spiritual matter of which you cannot comprehend it. You haven't even got the capacity of a baby to handle the milk of the Gospel how are you going to understand the meat of the Gospel. Line upon line and precept upon precept is the only way you'll be able to comprehend the ways of God. I am much more knowledgeable about God's plan for His children than I was 20 years ago. I expect I'll know quite a bit more in 20 years from now too.
I never said other Christians are evil or intend for it to sound that way. If you are a Christian you sure don't act like it and furthermore you don't have the humility to eve

rockstar11998 (2008-06-01)

I also want to comment on this statement of yours - "What makes you so darn sure that the LDS Church isn?t part of the apostasy mentioned in the Holy Bible." For starters there is also spoken of a restoration and/or restitution of all things in the Bible and we are the only church that claims this happened. So how could we not be if no one else admits they are that restored church. All it takes is a bit of logic and good study of the scriptures to know that the LDS church is the only one that fulfills these prophecies of the Old and New testaments pertaining to the last days. Do some research in Isaiah, Ezekiel, Amos, Daniel, and most of the New Testament and compare it with the teachings and history of the LDS church and you'll find a perfect match. No other church will claim this nor do they understand why it had to happen. I like how what you say gives meaning to the phrase the blind leading the blind. You sir are blinded to the truth. You are going through a great famine of hearing the words of God.

CarlWilfilUranus (2008-06-02)

rockstar11998: I apologize for the abundance of question marks everywhere that appear to fragment my sentences. They're supposed to be commas, single and double quotes, exclamation marks, a series of periods that somehow got decoded by Pirate Bay software. But I'm thankful it's still legible and not encrypted by Wingdinds. (Egad!! A Mormon conspiracy to stymie my message! Relax, Dude! Just kidding!) Look, I?m not trying to put you down for your plainness. In fact, I'm not trying to put you down ? PERIOD! So if you feel put down 'cos you're so plain, it's time to take stock of a personal failing. Or just get out of the kitchen (and rattle those pots and pans, like Elvis suggests! Might do ya some good!). Sorry! I forgot we?re on a serious topic here! Now to lay some of your accusations to rest, if you think I'm a know it all you haven't had a run in with my Ex! Now THAT'S who I'd call a true Prophet! And she isn't even Mormon! But her predictions were right on, Brother!! She predicted I'd lose my house, my kids, my cars, my businesses ? Now I stay pretty much incognito 'cos the Prophetess predicted I'll lose my ass on false charges if I didn't quit with the Ex-wife jokes!
I am quite familiar with Matthew 25 and the Parable of the 10 Virgins ? which has been the subject of different interpretations. Five got lucky with the groom 'cos they brought along some lube oil to facilitate the cherished ritual. The other five were locked out for the moment 'cos the groom had his hands full. The lucky bastard! Besides, there was a sign on the door that read, "NO MORE THAN FIVE VIRGINS ALLOWED IN PER VISIT", but these desperate bimbos couldn't read diddly squat. The commotion outside was unrelenting, perseverant, and very interfering to the indoor players. "Lord, Lord, open to us!" they begged pitifully, incessantly banging on the locked door. (Note: In Biblical lingo, "Open TO us" is a euphemistic phrase used exclusively by virgins instead of the coarse equivalent, "Open US UP"). Hence the fiery bark from the distracted and thoroughly pissed off groom, "Assuredly, I say to you, I do not KNOW you." ("KNOW" is another Biblical synonym for "carnal knowledge"). That's just the groom's way of telling the picketers outside, "You ain't gettin' no meat, Byatch! Not tonight! So git!"

On the one hand you dissociate yourself from selected sections of the Holy Bible and rewrite your very own Book of Mormon. But you have no problem quoting the Scriptures when/IF it jives with your particular school of thought! Hypocritical? Judge for yourself! "How many practices in the Bible are only found in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints and no other church. I can count more than 10 for sure." OK. Do these include infanticide, incest, adultery, pedophilia, polygamy? I notice how smoothly you glide over the polygamy issue 'cos we're such dumbfucks that we wouldn?t understand the spiritual component. What kind of spirit are we talking about here, Champ? Jack Daniels? 110% proof? Duh! Do I sound sufficiently dumb now? Actually, I'm all for polygamy if you make it work for all participant spouses, children and the community. I don't see any lewdness in such marriages, but count me out! With my luck going the way it had been, I?d probably hook up with other "Prophetesses" more vicious with their prophesizing than the previous ones. Mercy! Besides, I can't afford to start and support a new family or a harem. As for me "regurgitating lies about your church" is a lie by itself. I was testing you with a dose of your own snake oil, and, just as expected, all I got back was obscure generalizations way, way short of a plausible defense because Reverend Ignoramus thinks we're too freaking dumb to TRULY understand his horse logic! Did I say LOGIC? Oops, Sorry! That was just a typo!
So let me clue you in as to what I TRULY understand. Your several assertions that gravitate on your superior knowledge 'cos you're in the know! And you needn't exert your cranial muscles unnecessarily 'cos you k

CarlWilfilUranus (2008-06-02)

rockstar11998 : CONTINUING ON:
The God I'm familiar with is Compassionate, Forgiving, Guiding, Protecting, Knower of the Visible and Invisible, Magnificent, Just, the Creator from naught, Master of the Day of Judgment ??.. Most Merciful of those capable of Mercy, whose Love for us EXCEEDS the love of seventy mothers!
Whether I'm branded as Christian, Moslem, Jew, Mormon, etc. is irrelevant. I am a seeker of truth. Truth is not confined exclusively within the tinted walls of YOUR PARTICULAR VERSION of the LDS church! Know?wum?sayin?
Do yourself a favor, Pilgrim: Lighten up. Take a laxative or something. At least it'll keep you regular! Break away from your rigid cult mindset. Go get a job! Do something constructive. GET A LIFE! Peace.

rockstar11998 (2008-06-02)

CarlWilfilUranus - aka Korihor - I have decided to give you the nickname Korihor because you are trying to use different tactics to try to undermine my message. You still continue to use lies by saying you had no intention of putting me down. So all that talk about Junior High and being an idiot was to build me up right??? You are proof that Satan always uses the same techniques to deceive others. First make them seem like nothing and then try to deceive them with pleasing language and twisted ideas. I'm not the least amused by your ex-wife comments nor would I assume she is a prophetess unless she were LDS. Your comments about the 10 virgins proves to me you have no intention of taking seriously and of the spiritual things I speak of. Like I said you are but an infant in regards to understanding spiritual things. You make a mockery of them rather then trying to understand the deeper meanings and applications in daily life. The term virgin is symbolic of purity and innocence. Thanks for showing me you truly don't understand scripture or spiritual matters.
I'd like to comment about an issue you bring up with this statement - "OK. Do these include infanticide, incest, adultery, pedophilia, polygamy? I notice how smoothly you glide over the polygamy issue." Like I said you are way too immature and evil to understand the deeper doctrines of God's church. I will not attempt to cast my pearls before swine because it will do you nor I any good. I will clarify basic beliefs you attempt to put down and leave the deeper stuff alone because it is way over your head anyway. I've never practiced infanticide whatever that is, adultery, or pedophilia either. I guess you are getting us mixed up with the Catholic church or something. Most likely you just heard something and believed it without any regard for our written doctrines and current practices.
About us picking and choosing from the Bible you have got that all wrong. The Book of Mormon isn't a rewrite of the Bible but it is another testament of Jesus Christ. The Bible itself speaks of another stick (stick=scroll=book - the stick of Joseph) that would be written. The stick of Judah is the Bible and the stick of Joseph is the Book of Mormon. I can plainly lay out the scriptures for you but you will never understand them with your know it all and contentious attitude. It's also obvious you have a huge chip on your shoulder and are now seeking to put down any and all supporters of Christianity because you most likely got turned away from your own church. Did I hit the nail on the head yet??? You don't like my generalizations huh? Well too bad because that's all you'll get and logic won't get you closer to God unless it is First backing up a spiritual witness. All you are trying to do is contend with me and you admitted it. So I will not give in to your devil's approach to religion and logic. Korihor tried it that way and he was struck dumb by a prophet of God. I give you the same warning as Alma gave Korihor. If you continue to spread lies and deny the truth before you, you will be cursed and humbled by God. I already gave this warning to bodthdog and its been some time since I've seen him. He is another Antichrist just like you.
Your crude language also testifies against you and how you do not seek anything spiritual but only that which is worldly and devilish. You are one of the mockers from the great and spacious building in the vision seen by Lehi in the Book of Mormon. You have no foundation and will be greatly disappointed when your life on this world ends. The only ones that will 'miss the boat' as you say are the ones too stubborn and hardheaded to humble themselves and seek after righteousness. My church makes it possible for all of God's children to be saved past, present and future who follow these tenants of life. Satan has filled your heart with so much pride and anger you have no other choice but to take your frustrations out on any religious person you can find. Wo unto you when the time of Judgment comes. I love

CarlWilfilUranus (2008-06-04)

rockstar11998: Wassamatter, Champ? Pulling up your drawers so quickly and booting me out! And just as I wus getting started on you! Was my foreplay too rough for a "plain" man to handle? Or have you suddenly realized that, according to the tenants of your "religion", you aren't allowed to e-talk to me, an "apostate /heretic"! Because you just might be shown the truth! The Loony Bin is overflowing with wackos claiming to be Jesus, Melchizedek, Napoleon, Elvis, even God working incognito for the LDS Church ? Mercy!
Listen Dude, you?re as funny as fuck! You claim to hold the Holy Melchezidek Priesthood yet you can't even spell Melchizedek! But wasn't that also the problem with the early printing of your Book of Mormon that you claim came directly from God? Apparently God flunked his 3rd Grade spelling test as well because the LDS Church spent millions to correct the spelling and grammar. And when the corrected/edited version was finally released, some sections that were present in the "Original" publication were absent in subsequent releases! Yes, we know: The word of a living prophet supersedes that of bygone stiffs. So the Word keeps changing according to whim.
You again sidestepped the polygamy and incest issues. You claimed to know of more than 10 practices in the Bible that are only found in the LDS Church and no other church. I was interested in knowing whether infanticide, incest, adultery, pedophilia, polygamy were included among the 10 LDS Church practices you counted. I was NOT asking whether you personally practiced infanticide, incest, adultery, pedophilia, polygamy. OK? Nevertheless, you denied practicing infanticide (WHATEVER THAT IS), adultery, pedophilia. CAN WE REASONABLY ASSUME THAT, BY NOT DENYING INCEST AND POLYGAMY FORTHRIGHT, YOU HAVE IN FACT PRIVATELY ADMITTED TO IT? Does this conform to Church policy or is it a special privilege claimed through priesthood? Joseph Smith is said to have had 27 wives, and Brigham Young had 25 wives. Can we safely assume these were not some other poor bastard's wives that Joe and Bringham were "having"? And how did they manage time for other less important church activities, what with the ball-busting demands of a feisty harem? Dear Abby: I'm so fucking confused!!
Here's some of the shit we know about your cult: That you worship many gods (Mormon Doctrine, p. 163.)? There is a mother god, (Articles of Faith, by James Talmage, p. 443.) ? God is married to his goddess wife and has spirit children, (Mormon Doctrine p. 516.) ? ? Jesus' sacrifice was not able to cleanse us from all our sins, (murder and repeated adultery are exceptions), (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 3, p. 247, 1856.) ?.. You mock the oneness of God: "Many men say there is one God; the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost are only one God. I say that is a strange God [anyhow]--three in one and one in three. . .It is curious organization? All are crammed into one God according to sectarianism (Christian faith). It would make the biggest God in all the world. He would be a wonderfully big God--he would be a giant or a monster." (Joseph Smith, Teachings, 372)?.That "God was once a man as we are" and has a tangible body . . . of flesh and bones." (Articles of Faith, by James Talmage, p. 38) ? That He was created and there are several 'gods' ruling their very own little turf in the universe ? We all have the potential to be a god ? ? That "Lying for God" is permissible ?. The Devil was born as a spirit after Jesus "in the morning of pre-existence," (Mormon Doctrine, page 192.) ? Jesus and Satan are spirit brothers and we were all born as siblings in heaven to them both, (Mormon Doctrine, p. 163.) ?. God had sexual relations with Mary to make the body of Jesus, (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 4, p. 218, 1857; vol. 8, p. 115.) ?. That you guys have a long documented history of fornication and polygamy ? That, until recently, black people were devils ? After Cain killed his brother Abel, God cursed Cain with black skin (Does that mean our ancestors were Negro?) ? The book "

CarlWilfilUranus (2008-06-04)

rockstar11998: CONTINUING ON
How dare you put down my Mormon friends. You don't even know them to form an opinion! For the record, I'll have you know, some of my very best (and easiest) lays were Mormon hussies. Bless them, Lord, 'cos they sure spread some happiness on my face (and it didn't cost a dime 'cos these Mormon bimbos sure love to spread their happiness on people's faces)! Do ah hear an AMEN, Brutah!? And what did you do to bodthedog? Maybe he's got more sense than I to waste time reasoning with a myopic bigot. We didn't see eye to eye on some issues. We butted heads a couple of times, but I could reason with him and hold an intelligent, objective discussion. I developed respect for him. So did you sic the Gideonite hitmen on him like you did on Korihor? To snuff out Freedom of Speech and Belief? Are you threatening to have me killed? Or are you trying to lay a hex on me? OK. I'm waiting ? Oh. Oh. Something's happening! I?m serious, Dude! You've just psyched me into having a rockstar erection! I think I'll invite that callipygian Mormon priestess neighbor over while her hubby is out sermonizing with Wife No. 3 tonight! Gotta go ? duty (and Mormon booty) calls!

Listen up, Dude! And listen good: Go preach your version of the gospel to a captive audience with vanquished minds properly primed for the next level of brainwashing. Mormons are not Christian! Christians believe in ONE God; you don't. I believe your "church", your "prophets", your Books, your claims are LIES. I believe you to be a liar; so also those who preach your "church" blasphemous doctrines. I believe you all are nothing but an organized bunch of deceivers shunned by mainstream society: You flatter yourself and call it persecution but we know it as revulsion. As expressed by Charles W. Penrose in a letter to John Taylor in 1887: "?the endless subterfuges and prevarications which our present condition imposes? threaten to make our rising generation a race of deceivers." (B. Carmon Hardy, Solemn Covenant: The Mormon Polygamous Passage, p. 368).
You have the audacity to liken me to the Antichrist? That's like the chimney calling the lamp black! So be gone lest a TRUE servant of the ONE TRUE GOD treats you like a pockmarked, pimple faced, red hair stepchild ?. you and your vile pile of lying dung ? your "church", your charlatan "prophets", and the legions of demons you call upon. Go corrupt easier prey! And may the One Living God protect us from your chicanery and expose you for what you truly are!

rockstar11998 (2008-06-04)

CarlWilfilUranus aka Korihor aka Antichrist - You bring with you the evilest and vilest spirit. Korihor would be proud to call you brother. I am ashamed to even belong to the same spiritual family as you. To think you didn't pick the side of Satan before coming to earth is very shocking to me after hearing how disrespectful and profane you are. Satan is very proud of your behavior and is happy to call you his.
You assume you've gotten the better of me with your profane put downs and such but all you are doing is digging yourself a deeper grave in hell. I do not fear you nor do I need to explain any more plain and simple truths to you because you will not even give them a place to grow. You are like the stony ground that the sower sowed his seed on. It cannot take root because the ground isn't even close to being fertile and able to nourish it to grow. You have no concept of spiritual matters and apparently you prefer it that way. You are just like the Pharisees of Jesus' day. You assume that I am not allowed to talk to you. No! You've made it clear you have no intention of having a discussion and make a mockery of anything I teach you about the truth. So you have cut yourself off from the truth rather than me saying I give up. I'd rather talk to a dead fish than waste my time on someone that won't even consider and particle of truth given him. I am sure you've had some real bad experience in your past or recent past that has enangered you but I won't be your guinea pig for seeing how far you can piss someone off because it makes you feel better to bring others down to your level. I wish to bring you to a higher level but that would require humility of which you don't know the first thing about. If you had any truth to share with me I'd gladly incorporate it into my own beliefs but alas that will never be so.
Once again I must clarify the idiocy that is rampant in the anti-mormon public. The Book of Mormon was dictated by Joseph Smith, he had several human scribes throughout the process, the editing was added later. Joseph Smith didn't write it because at the time he had a very low grade level of education and the use of scribes was a way God was allowing others to see the miracle of its coming forth. Keep showing me how little you know about the history of my church and I'll keep making you look like the fool that you are. No other portions but the 116 pages lost by Martin Harris were taken out of the Book of Mormon. Actually there is about 2/3 of the golden plates that still haven't been translated. Yes you are correct (finally) saying that the message of the current prophet supersedes that of the former prophets. That is why Moses was able to give the ten commandments, that is why Jesus Christ was able to do away with the Law of Moses, that is why the leadership organization was changed from the Sanhedrin to the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, and I could go on and on. With all of this said it still doesn't allow for a current prophet to change the doctrine of God. The LDS church has never done that. We still believe the practice of polygamy has its place and is a true doctrine but it is currently not practiced just like the Law of Moses currently isn't practiced yet it will be practiced again as prophesied in the Book of Revelations and Doctrine and Covenants. Don't think you have an argument against my beliefs because I am way too knowledgeable to be swayed on any subject or question to try to bring up. I don't sidestep polygamy and admit it was practiced as commanded by God by many of the early leaders of the church. That is nothing new to most people so why ask such a silly question? God commanded it of Jacob as well so what have you to say of that???
So you still like to follow the crowd and call my church a cult. Indeed we can say we worship or believe in many Gods. Jesus Christ is a God and so is God the Father. Did you not read in Genesis where it states "let US make him in OUR own image". Wow the Bible confirms the LDS beliefs again, what a shocker. I wo

Obsydyon (2008-06-04)

Man...you guys are boring...have you noticed that its only you two talking to each other? Get a room1 =D

CarlWilfilUranus (2008-06-04)

Obsydyon, Dude: You're so damn right on! That's the ONLY truth sticking out of all the previous garbage (like a formidable phallus ready for battle). If there's one thing I've learned from "discussions" with my Ex, is to let pedantic bitches have the last word 'cos otherwise there'd be no end in sight. SO I'LL QUIT WHILE I'M AHEAD! Peace.
(And furthermore, it's NOT "WO WO Wo", Professor: It is "WOE WOE WOE. Can't you even spell out your Hex correctly?).

rockstar11998 (2008-06-04)

CarlWilfilUranus - Quit while you're ahead LMFAO. You were never ahead. You are imagining that you are tho so I guess in your mind that's good enough. I don't wish to get 'one up' on you but to clarify your lies and assumptions and of course try to set you back on course with truth. My use/spelling of wo is not without justification. It is used in the wo form not woe form in scriptures I use (The Book of Mormon). Thanks for showing me again how uneducated you really are about my beliefs. Since you decided to use some scriptures to back up your comments (weakly and without any understanding of what they truly mean), I've decided to share with you how I know you are not a true Christian if you are one at all. I am going to give some passages from Section 84 of the Doctrine and Covenants which Joseph Smith received as revelation in the year 1832. Most of the section talks about the Priesthood which you obviously know nothing about, but the part I am going to share pertains to the part where I know you are not being Christian and nor do you seek truth. Section 84: 45-53 - verse 45 -For the word of the Lord is truth, and whatsoever is truth is light, and whatsoever is light is Spirit, even the Spirit of Jesus Christ.
46 And the Spirit giveth light to every man that cometh into the world; and the Spirit enlighteneth every man through the world, that hearkeneth to the voice of the Spirit.
47 And every one that hearkeneth to the voice of the Spirit cometh unto God, even the Father.
48 And the Father teacheth him of the covenant which he has renewed and confirmed upon you, which is confirmed upon you for your sakes, and not for your sakes only, but for the sake of the whole world.
49 And the whole world lieth in sin, and groaneth under darkness and under the bondage of sin.
50 And by this you may know they are under the bondage of sin, because they come not unto me.
51 For whoso cometh not unto me is under the bondage of sin.
52 And whoso receiveth not my voice is not acquainted with am voice, and is not of me.
53 And by this you may know the righteous from the wicked, and that the whole world groaneth under sin and darkness even now.
You are not acquainted with the voice of God at all because you make it very clear by your speech that you are in the bondage of sin. Therefore you are not Christian even if you'd like to think you are. You do not act like one nor do you talk like one. You have no form of Godliness in you. Wo Wo Wo unto you.

CarlWilfilUranus (2008-06-05)

Rockstar11998: You are absolutely correct about the painfully obvious: Joey had a very low grade of education; and the scribes, even lower. No matter. 'Cos the high grade of magical rock ("seer stone") anointing his nostrils sure tripped his imagination to a new level of "enlightenment", didn't it? "The editing was added later", you say. And it is still linguistically inferior. Unless your grammarians were into Ebonics! Just like Santa Claus: WOE is WO (Book of Mormon), and WHORE! WHORE! WHORE! Is HO! HO! HO! (Santa). That's just one of the several flaws evident in your Book of Mormon ? A TESTAMENT TO INGRATITUDE AND TREASON: "And again; wo, wo, wo unto the nation of these United States, for your sins are increased before God in that ye have suffered the persecutions and oppression from which your fathers fled when they came to this land, to be practiced within your borders." (From the Gospel Reflector P. 658). Joey is so full of venomous Hexes against this nation and others, it's not even funny! And just 'cos people take exception to having the polytheism lie stuffed up their butt; besides, Joey and his Merry Clan have a problem keeping their boners in check! Don't blaspheme by equating fiction to the Scriptures.
You "worship and believe in many gods" yet try to pass off as Christian? "Jesus Christ is A god" (just one of several) "and so is God the Father" (another separate 'god'!). I certainly DID read in Genesis where it states "let US make him in OUR own image". Didn?t you know that to address oneself in the third person / plural form is a privilege reserved only for kings, monarchs, and Deity? And isn't God (not your garden variety of Mormon 'gods' but THE ONE LIVING GOD) the King of Kings entitled to that privilege? Quit deceiving people into misinterpreting the Holy Scriptures. Look. I believe your 'church' has a right to make a sleazy buck regardless of the level you're willing to sink down to. Most people just don't like to be lied to while you're making your sales pitch.
LMFAO? Sounds like a Mormon invitation, "Lay/Lube My Fat Ass Over". Well, not tonight, Honey. I've got a couple of Mormon hussies here gettin' primed for a Lube Job! But since you're content flirting around with acronyms instead of 'baptizing' your flock, which part of "GIT don't you understand?

rockstar11998 (2008-06-05)

CarlWilfilUranus - aka Korihor - aka Antichirst - You'd like to think that my beliefs blaspheme God but on the other had they glorify Him because I understand His plan and gladly except it and teach it to others. LOL you are boring me with the wo vs woe issue. The meaning/cursing is the same. Just like think and thinketh. It has nothing to do with errors but the language God chose to use. Man corrupts God's language. Joseph Smith made a pure translation but the same cannot be said of the Bible. Some of Joseph's scribes were not the most educated but they were more so than he in order to be used as a scribe. Just because the process of bringing forth the Book of Mormon didn't go as you'd like it to that doesn't mean it wasn't legit. You'll never understand the ways of God so long as you seek for perfection in the process God uses when seeing with the eyes of a natural man vs that of a spiritual man. I totally agree with any prophecies and 'hexes' set out by the prophets. pertaining the United States. The Book of Mormon plainly states that this is to be a chosen land and if we don't worship God it will be a cursed land. So what else you got that I can clear up for our readers??? I like how you blow off the scriptures by not accepting the words US and Our to mean plurality. The Pearl of Great Price and other doctrines in the LDS church clarify why this must be. Does it make sense for a father to not have a father. If God (as stated in the scriptures) wishes us to call upon Him as Heavenly Father in the name of Jesus Christ He must have a father. Reason that out and you'll see clearly what I'm talking about. My church's doctrine makes perfect sense but you are too weak and feeble minded to comprehend the fullness of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ is the King of Kings and Lord of Lords which are worldly titles. The one true living God because all other man made Gods are worthless and have no power and are therefore dead. If Jesus Christ claimed to be a God (which he did - he had the power to raise others from the dead right) and was crucified for it, why would a God pray to another Higher than he? Because in heaven their is a hierarchy as well. I know I'm going way over your head now but to me it is clear as day. Haven't you ever looked at the vastness of space and thought hmm that's a lot of wasted space if I'm the only planet with life on it. I've seen a lot of stuff about how scientists are discovering millions of universes and many solar systems similar to ours within each. The universe as we know it is expanding. Hmm I wonder why it would do that? Because it needs to accommodate the new Gods making their own dominions.
I really laugh when you refer to the scriptures as Holy when you profane the servants of God and mock them with your interpretations. You are not a Christian at all. The heathens in deep New Guinea are more Christ like than you. What is this sales pitch you refer to? I pay because I am commanded to pay tithes. I've had leadership roles and know where all the money goes so don't try to tell me the church misuses its funds or isn't using the money for righteous purposes. You are the liar and deceiver not me. Git? what are you some kind of hick. Your backwoods thinking sure makes it seem like you are. The only invitation I give you is the one to change your ways and be happy before it's too late. I still curse you for your mockery of holy things.

CarlWilfilUranus (2008-06-05)

So which of your several 'gods' are you glorifying while blaspheming against God? Yes, there's a hierarchy in Heaven and it begins with HE WHO CREATED IT ALL. God is not "Father" to anyone or anything. He is CREATOR from naught. When He intends for a thing to be, He commands, "BE"! AND IT IS! Now reason THIS out: Maybe your run-of-the-mill, garden variety of pagan 'gods' endowed with a limp 2 inch 'rod' of play putty did indulge in extra-marital fornication with some gullible bimbo 'goddesses' and 'begot' a fertile clan of baby 'gods' running amuck in your church in leaky diapers claiming divinity. BUT CERTAINLY NOT GOD! Consider this: If there were more than one god as you Mormons claim, how come every Mormon hussy I "baptize" (and their numbers are happily growing! Hee. Hee!) keep moaning "Oh God! Oh God!" instead of, "Oh GODS! OH GODS!" Proof enough, huh? Don't believe me? Take time out from your fraudulent escapades on the internet and try it out on your Mormon harem (before some horny heretic beats you to it!). Hear for yourself, Chief: They'll make you a Believer in monotheism (unless they're accustomed to faking it with you)!
One sec ? I'll be right back.

CarlWilfilUranus (2008-06-05)

rockstar11998:OK. I'm back. I had to respond to a spiritual calling. DUDE, YOU JUST GOTTA KNOW ABOUT THIS: While I was relieving myself, 'twas Smithy, the Big Kahuna himself, materializing from the commode with his inseparable, loaded hat! And he's gyrating his pelvis provocatively to "I AIN?T NOTTIN' BUT A HORNDOG" with Johnny Baptist's bad-ass Stratocaster dangling from his neck! While we wus kickin' back in the shithouse snorting that godawesome chunk of magical rock he keeps in his hat to hide it from cops (i.e., getting' stoned on the heavenly Seer Stone), I was talking him into Hinduism 'cos they got some real cool views on the fine art of Boning. "Didja check out the Kamasutra" I asked? "Sure. Dad and I would gawk at the hot pics whenever Mom set it down. But that's kid's stuff compared to the Arab Perfumed Garden. It made a Believer out of me!" Too damn late! Smithy had already converted to Islam 'cos that's the only other legit way he'd get to banging more than one wife (all his own, this time around!) ? but mercifully not more than four at any single time. 'Seems he's taking a break from the ballbusting demands of his Mormon harem. He's kinda dicksore as there's no limit to the ambitious hussies eagerly awaiting for his prophetic phallus to break 'em in to enlightenment. He says, everyone wants to become a Mormon prophet and future god so their erring flock could do some 'penance' on their knees ? in the proper way! "So why do I get blamed for starting such a fun religion, huh?"
And, guess what, Rocky Baby? He personally ordained me PROPHET OF HIGHEST OF THE HIGHEST MEETZABIGDICK PRIESTHOOD (and getting' higher the more I snorted that potent stuff!). So now I am empowered to do some fancy cussing of my very own. So watchit, Pilgrim, before I puke all over you! Except, I've run out of puke after reading your response! Damn!
If the LDS church were false, would you be willing to pull your head out of your ass and see for yourself instead of restricting yourself to your hallowed colonic darkness and pointing a soiled finger on what others believe? Aren't you obliged to avoid all sources of loud laughter, lightmidedness, evil speaking of the lords anointed, and any other impure or unholy practice? Are you sticking around 'cos my Mormon goddesses here are psyching you into a much needed but short lived boner? WHY DON?T YOU HYPOCRITES FOLLOW YOUR OWN SACRED 11TH ARTICLE OF FAITH? "We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may." Either your living 'prophet' took a healthy dump on that idea or you're gonna come up with another creative 'rational' explanation as to why it's not applicable in this case, or God will explain later 'cos I'm not 'ready' for it just yet, right? You're so slick, Slick!
I bear Joseph Smith's testimony to the truthfulness of my Priesthood cum Prophethood cum future godhood (just ask these Mormon bimbos gratefully receiving my spirit), to the lies of your conveniently shifting ideologies, and instruct you to do as well, to not resist my spirit or my schlong for your own prideful purposes, to share your Little Black Book (their tithes and titties) with me and 'commandeth' the broads to 'heeleth' 'afrontoth' my Iron Rod?. I'll come up with more cool instructions incrementally in your lingo as and when Joey 'instructeth' me ? but only WHEN YOU?RE READY AND WORTHY, 'cos you?re still suckling milk from yo' mama?s titties; your pride 'hindereth' me from sticking my Meat of Knowledge in thou Fanny of Ignorance!! Now, do I 'heareth' an AMEN, Brutah?
Man. I'm bored as fuck! "If you fight with a skunk, you end up smelling like the skunk. If you lie with dogs, you end up with fleas. If you argue with kooks, you end up being more kooky than they". I?m beginning to reek. Just like bodthedog, you've killed me with your divine pignorance. I'm outta here 'cos Joey beckoneth me 'tither' with that blesse

rockstar11998 (2008-06-05)

CarlWilfilUranus - aka Korihor - aka Antichirst - Jesus Christ is our savior, the creator of this world, and will be our perfect judge. God the Father is the Father of our spirits and directs everything Christ and his prophets do on earth. That is why every time the Father visits He lets Jesus do all of the talking. Sorry but science has already proven that you cannot make something from nothing. You need to read the Pearl of Great price where it clearly states that God took materials that already existed and formed the earth from them. You say that God is not Father to anyone or anything - ok now I know you're not a Christian because the Bible clearly says we are His children and that Jesus Christ is also His son. You are so full of lies and deceit it disgusts me. What's truly funny about your approach is that as soon as you attempt to talk about spiritual things you go right into the profane. You keep proving to me and others how lost you truly are and how much the spirit of the devil fills your heart. 'By their fruits ye shall know them.' All of your fruit is rotten and good for nothing sir. I will disregard all of your perverted and sick nonsense about Joseph Smith because you already know you are 'speaking evil of the Lord's anointed'. This was the cause of death for many in the old testament and cursed are those who do this. That is why I have cursed to and still warn you of forthcoming punishments if you continue on this path of filth, hate, lies and profaneness. Wo unto you. Thanks for your quote of the 11th articles of faith. I am doing great at this along with the rest of the church because we don't preach outright against any church (unlike you), we don't force our LDS beliefs on anyone (unlike your attempts), and we are friends with many religions around the world. So where is your argument. That's right you don't have one because you just like to spout off all sorts of random things without proper knowledge of what we belief and how we live. Every time I put you in your place about what we do believe you come up with some other wild stories and fantasies you have about us. Satan is a busy guy with you. You say I'm slick no I am plain and straightforward. You are perverted and deceitful and you know it. You're right about the stench part. You reek bad because you are nothing but a skunk. A wolf in sheep's clothing. Anyone can plainly see with your speech you never had or will have any Priesthood power. You are lost forever until you change and humble yourself.

Sm_McDunk (2008-06-07)

Are you idiots still Dukeing it out? Internet Blogs are overflowing with Mormon lizard brains defecating the same LDS BS disguised as divine commands! Most sane people learn to stay clear of cult zealots for reasons evident in this silly saga. Cultists are known for pirating sites like this, using it as a free forum for their exploitative propaganda. This Carl guy stands to recognize this like countless others did. I see the contextual appropriateness of Carl's humor. I think he was deliberately being as ridiculous as your 'doctrines and the pretexts 'supporting' them. (Though he could have illustrated his analogy with G Rated comments). Nevertheless, why dismiss outright his LIVING testimony of his Anointing and prefer MULTIPLE HEARSAY FROM THE DEAD? If your yardstick for falsity is Carl's 'profaneness' and 'perversion', this is the very same standard Joseph Smith was persecuted on by skeptics, for his profanity against 'traditional' Christian theology and corporal perversions such as polygamy, pedophilia, incest, etc. And the 'mystic power' of the Seer Stone.
You typify the usual Mormon hogwash and tongue in cheek justifications attempting a sorry cover up: Same typical wordings, same typical (horse)logic, same typical MO, same typical diatribe, and obviously the same typical script! We all recognize cultists as the INDISPUTABLE GODS OF ASININITY. No measure of earthly persuasion can move you toward introspection because fallible mortals are limited by the 'grey matter' in our skull, and celestial beings like yourself carry an abundance of 'Outer Space' in that Black Hole of your cranium. We speak different languages. Hence we, the 'Primitive Life Forms', are thoroughly confused with your extra dimensional, chameleon assertions as to why we didn't TRULY see what we saw, didn't TRULY hear what we heard, didn't TRULY understand the obvious, and your same insane dynamics that continue to mutate Truth right before our very eyes! WE SEE SOMETHING SERIOUSLY OUT OF WHACK WITH YOUR FLIGHT PLAN, CAPTAIN: Perhaps God will explain it to us later when we become humble like intellect free zombies, and thus 'ready' for programming.
I did take the time to read the Mormon Gospel Reflector. It surely IS rampant with offensive ideology, imaginative claims, bigotry, ingratitude toward our nation and TREASON (P. 658). And Mormons are still wondering why they are persecuted as treasonous traitors? Your comments on 'hicks' and 'backwoods thinking' clearly reflect prejudice and contempt. You forget the part 'hicks' played in building this great nation, and opportunistic parasites like you kick them to the curb yet bleed them of their honest humble earnings. Your preaching, your practices and your other doctrines digress sharply from your Articles of Faith, personal integrity, and civic mores. "WE DON'T PREACH OUTRIGHT AGAINST ANY CHURCH": Typical Mormon BS! You cultists are known for inflammatory, prejudicial propaganda and are instrumental in propagating Hate Crimes under the fallacious guise of a protected First Amendment Right! Did it not start with your vitriolic preaching about the evil in Islam, how deceitful and perverted it is, that Koran is the work of Satan, Mohammed is a false prophet, WE WANT TO FIGHT AGAINST ISLAM, I PICK ON ISLAM BECAUSE IT IS THE GREATEST THREAT TO THE WHOLE WORLD (to YOUR Lilliputian world) AND BECAUSE I AM INFORMED MORE SO THAN YOU. By 'informed' you obviously mean properly and thoroughly brainwashed, brain-fried, or brainless?. CHRISTIANITY WAS FULL OF FALSE DOCTRINE, FALSE TEACHERS AND PROPHETS. Yet you quote the 'original' Scriptures as gospel and profess to follow them? (But only when convenient; then Aesop?s Fables kick in). WE DON'T FORCE OUR LDS BELIEFS ON ANYONE?. That is exactly what you have been doing all along, with intimidation, threats, and superstitious hexes. Either we believe in what you Outer Space AstroNUTS tell us to believe in, or we will be damned along with half the crew of your own LDS Spaceship. I NEVER SAID OTHER CHRISTIANS ARE EVIL OR INTE

rockstar11998 (2008-06-08)

Sm_McDunk - aka Korihor - aka AntiChrist - looks like we have ourselves another anti-Mormon/Antichrist. Cult zealot? Are you that uninformed. The LDS church has over 13 million members and the largest women's organization in the world. I'm not sure where you get your information but to say we are a cult is foolishness and stupidity. Divine commands - you bet. The thing about my church is that you don't have to take my words for it. You are challenged and required to ask God whether what we teach is truth. One who is in tune with spiritual things will already know that LDS doctrine is truth through the Holy Ghost but prayer will confirm those feelings and understanding.
Exploitative propaganda? What drugs are you on. I have nothing to gain from this. I am trying to help others out. I am not seeking brownie points but trying to help you and others find out truth about God. I am giving you a chance to change. It's what the servants of God do. I am also giving you a warning. If you continue to spread lies, hate, and deceit you will be greatly punished and cursed. If you are spreading lies unknowingly I urge you to do some real research about my church and test it before you rattle off some anti-Mormon lies you read or heard. Then I know if you are a seeker of truth you'll find it in the LDS faith. If you claim you've already done some fair research and study I'll know you are a promoter of lies and hate.
Carl wasn't using humor he was using crudeness which is directly from Satan. If you feel it was appropriate its clear you are in the same boat as he and are headed for eternal punishment. Tell me when is it ever appropriate to profane the scriptures. If you read his messages he was mocking the Bible as well - and at the same time claiming to be a Christian. What foolsl you and he are. All of those claims about Joseph Smith doing evil things are lies. Satan led the leaders and members of other churches to hate the 'Mormons' because they were afraid. Just as you are afraid of the truth. It means you'll have to change and the very foundation on which you base your beliefs has been shattered. I understand your issue with the LDS faith but I know I have the truth and millions have claimed the same KNOWLEDGE as me. The only thing you'll accomplish by trying to thwart the LDS church is that you will dig yourself a deeper hole of misery and anger and be held more captive by Satan. You will have a more and more greater need of the Atonement. One more thought about polygamy. Didn't you read in the Bible that some of the prophets of God had more than one wife. Shall we condemn them and toss out the Bible??? Just because you don't understand the scriptures you shouldn't assume others don't too. You are just a babe when it comes to spiritual matters. The meat of of the Gospel is indigestible to you because you can't even handle the milk of the Gospel.
Wow that load of intellectual garbage rhetoric is quite boring. I would quote a bunch of scriptures that put done those that think they are wise in the world but you've probably heard them before. I don't pretend to be smarter than everyone but I do claim to be more enlightened than those who aren't LDS. This changes my whole way of thinking and living and God blesses me for it. I invite all to feast at the fountain of living waters. Your denouncement of the LDS church is no different than the Pharisees and Scribes of Jesus' day. He came with a new and different law and he was persecuted and put to death for it. The world tried to do that to the LDS church at its outset but look at it today. As much as you don't want to recognize its 'good fruits', more and more of the world is. More and more countries are opening their doors to the preaching of the Restored Gospel because they see what good we bring to their people and the world. This comment is way off base - opportunistic parasites like you kick them to the curb yet bleed them of their honest humble earnings. I've been making honest humble earnings myself so I don'

rockstar11998 (2008-06-08)

Lol I ran out of room. Oh well. He says he'll be gone and hopefully that is true. No one needs to hear/read anymore of his lies and nonsense. He doesn't know the truth but I still wish for him to seek it out.

rockstar11998 (2008-06-11)

Sm_McDunk - aka AntiChrist - aka Korihor - aka AntiMormon. I apologize for my many typos. I was typing too fast and didn't proofread at the end. I meant to say burned at the STAKE instead of state. When I was speaking of a dam I meant to say. Those who AREN'T true and faithful to the plan of salvation will be damned in their progression.
To finish my thought about the prophets of old being justified in having others killed is because they had the AUTHORITY from God to do it. The Holy Spirit told them if was the will of God. Did Noah want all of the world to drown in the flood? No, he preached and built an ark but no one listened and the doors were shut when the flood came. Usually the killings occurred for protection in battle but in the case of the Israelites they had the right to slaughter the people in Palestine because God wanted their promised land to be completely cleansed of all heathens who might turn them away to sinful practices and to lead them to bow down and worship their idols and false Gods. They didn't completely rid the land of the heathens and that's why they ran into more trouble.
I want to say more about his comment about God had to be created. I had a lengthy discussion made up that didn't make it onto my prior response and went into some deep doctrine but now I will just say that God has always existed. Science has already proven that you can't make something from nothing. Certain words only take on meaning at certain points in time. Like eternal. Once we have achieved eternal life we will always have been eternal beings. From that point we are endless and therefore had no beginning. Time is irrelevant. God doesn't use time. That's why He can see the beginning and the end at the same time. This may seem confusing but I pondered it for a very long time and it is very reasonable to me now. From our perspective God has always been God. There was never a time in our existence that He wasn't. The same will be true for the spiritual offspring we have after we reach that position and glory. We will have always been God to them and no other God matters.
One thing that Sm_McDunk is finally right about is that Satan likes to mingle in a few lies with a lot of truth. That is why we have so many different churches today. Most of it is good and correct but the varying doctrines about what is required for salvation is what Satan wants us to contend about. This is all cleared up with the coming forth of the Book of Mormon. It proves which doctrines are legit and which are made up by man. Also Joseph Smith was given many other revelations that were recorded in the Doctrine and Covenants that clearly spell out what is required of us and what we can expect in the hereafter. I urge everyone to study these scriptures.
Here are some other wise words of his 'YOUR SOUL THEY ARE AFTER, BUT YOUR MONEY, YOUR MIND, AND YOUR TIME'. Very true we need your soul to be perfected and saved in the Kingdom of God, we are needing your money to help spread the Gospel to the ends of the Earth and to care for the poor and needy, we need your mind to be clear and focused on Spiritual matters rather than on worldliness (like his is), and we definitely can use all of the time you can give. It's called service and we are known for giving a lot of it. And that should be the last word on his lies and falsehoods so long as he keeps his word of staying away and saying no more about his evil lies.

rockstar11998 (2008-06-21)

Carlwilfulurans and SmMcdunk - aka Korihor - aka - Antichrist - I have some final thoughts for those that are anti-religious like thess guys and can't comprehend spiritual things. I have been repeating the thought that only spiritual knowledge can come from a spiritual person. I recently reread 1 Corinthians chapter 2 and it clearly lays this out. Here is the text:
1And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God.
2For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.
3 And I was with you in weakness, and in fear, and in much trembling.
4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:
5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.
6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:
7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:
8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
Isa 64:4
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

evilboy99 (2008-08-26)

islam will fuck you all...they hate everyone who does not believe in there bullshit...i mean what right ppl shag there sisters...noncey fooks..and that is right in islam...wrong fuckers...

carsten.666 (2008-08-30)

To rockstar11998
Do you really need a religion, to behave like a decent human being. It should be your own decision to behave properly, not a fear for the consekvenses in the "afterlife" that guides you.
I am personally not afraid of "god" or "satan". It is religious people that scares me.